Power-Spotting

[Rysade]

Ok, how do you know this?

--Dai Stihó

Bishie
'Mancer
Foam Poet

[PK]

"I was the Smith of Falias," said Biddy, "among others. I made Fragarach... yes."

"And then the stories tell about Gofan, the Smith of the Gods, who came to Lugh the Allcrafted," Nita said, "and how they went away together and took the Spear of Victory, Luin, and forged it full of fire and a fierce spirit..."

She looked at Nita and nodded slowly. "That was me as well."
~~A Wizard Abroad, chapter 8, Chearta na Chill Pheadair/Kilpedder Forge

I can see where that might be ambiguous, but a bit later (on the next page in my copy),

"And the spear?" Kit said.

"I remember some of the details," Biddy said softly. But I had that other Power to help me, the one they called Lugh the Allcrafted."

There is then the rather amusing statement that Nita can't get somebody who knows how to do everything, but can get someone who thinks she does. Well, the Defender did mention Dairine taking on her role, I suppose.

Also, Tualha:

...Arias the poet-smith, whom some called Govan, made it there. The song says that Arias took a star and hammered it on the anvil, and so made the blade of the spear...

And Nita later to Ronan, in the chapter Lughnasad...

You've got some of His blood... So He loved somebody when He was here physically, once. Maybe even as Lugh himself. ... But as soon as He could, He came hunting -- a suitable vessel.

And Lugh is definitely the Defender; Nita recognized the Power in Ronan's mind as Peach, and It also gets brought up as Michael the Archangel -- which is one of the names the Defender gave in HW (well, Michael, anyway) and probably the reference when the Lone Power is complaining to "Mike" on the phone in SYW.

I think that's probably more information than you needed, isn't it....

[Birdhead]

*tosses head* See, toldja. It's right there in print if you look...
T

Tuibird in Aotearoa
Conservationist, Scientist, and proud of both!
Chocolate lover extraordinaire...
Ahahahaha, ahahahahaha, ahahahaha...
My mission: Bringing Maori to the world!
Spelling Freak and Typo Queen

[PK]

Of course, Ronan thinks HIS situation is disturbing, imagine being a wizard who turns out to be (directly) related to the Lone Power. If It does that sort of thing. (Of course... Pralaya had children, I believe, but I was thinking more along the lines of Lugh than Ronan, if you see what I mean. Being "there physically" rather than hitchhiking on somebody else's soul.)

And I'm rambling off-topic.

Another interesting point: Kit's line that the Morrigan looked sort of like Biddy. But the Morrigan was mentioned as being present separately from Govan/Arias -- are we seeing another case something like the Defender being Athene and Prometheus both, or a "family resemblance" of sorts among the Powers (or at least the way Kit sees them), or his imagination?

[Birdhead]

Well, it could conceivably be a combination of them all. Also, it might be that Biddy and the Morrigan just had a certain feel to them that said, "we are powers-" even if it's not identifiable as such. So to the casual viwer, they appear or "resemble" each other physically.

Direct descendant of the LP? That would be CREEPY.
T

Tuibird in Aotearoa
Conservationist, Scientist, and proud of both!
Chocolate lover extraordinaire...
Ahahahaha, ahahahahaha, ahahahaha...
My mission: Bringing Maori to the world!
Spelling Freak and Typo Queen

[PK]

That's a neat idea.

Very creepy. And wizardry would be, logistically, fairly difficult if the particular manifestation were still around... possibly wizardry is not offered by the Bright Powers to potential wizards, even of the appropriate mindset, who have to live with or visit the LP regularly on that account. (Again, if it happens.) Then again... it's supposed to be wherever there's entropy to some degree...

Oh, I don't know.

Somewhat belatedly, Tane sounds very suited to the Defender indeed, and must have been deeply involved with the Battle of the Trees....

[Birdhead]

And wizardry would be, logistically, fairly difficult if the particular manifestation were still around... possibly wizardry is not offered by the Bright Powers to potential wizards, even of the appropriate mindset, who have to live with or visit the LP regularly on that account. (Again, if it happens.) Then again... it's supposed to be wherever there's entropy to some degree...

I doubt the Powers would discriminate on that basis. I can see them as offering the Oath to a descendant of the LP, and then coming to terms with that would almost certainly be part of their Ordeal. Wizardry would be mentally difficult, but I'm not sure about physically.

Somewhat belatedly, Tane sounds very suited to the Defender indeed, and must have been deeply involved with the Battle of the Trees....

ooh, NICE. I never even THOUGHT of that, and it's so lOGICAL. (perhaps it's because I associate the Battle with the Nth Hemisphere, and specifically Central park... and trees, like the Rowan, that are mentioned as being deeply involved, are not exactly NZ natives. Mind you, I just BET that the kauri were full on. )
T

Tuibird in Aotearoa
Conservationist, Scientist, and proud of both!
Chocolate lover extraordinaire...
Ahahahaha, ahahahahaha, ahahahaha...
My mission: Bringing Maori to the world!
Spelling Freak and Typo Queen

[PK]

I doubt the Powers would discriminate on that basis. I can see them as offering the Oath to a descendant of the LP, and then coming to terms with that would almost certainly be part of their Ordeal. Wizardry would be mentally difficult, but I'm not sure about physically.

I don't think they'd discriminate on the basis of being related to the Lone Power -- and I agree that coming to terms with the relationship would make a great deal of sense as part of the Ordeal -- but I could imagine that if the wizard in question were a very near descendant (child or grandchild) and the Lone One were still hanging around the area in person, things could get decidedly complicated. Especially if they lived together. I was thinking more along the lines of personal interference than the relationship making wizardry difficult by nature. It'd definitely be hard not to be noticed.... ("Uh... yeah, Mom, I've got to... go... meet my partner. For school! It's a language project.") ...I'm not making any sense, am I?

I always figured on the Battle of the Trees being worldwide, or when I thought about it anyway -- I'm completely unfamiliar with kauri though -- describe?

[meteorite]

Kauri are wonderful big trees with finely wrinkled bark (like a tulip poplar) and oval leaves about the size of a stick of gum, suitable for canoe-making. We have a couple specimens that were planted in downtown Honolulu. Very nice. Re: the Battle of the Trees, I expect that koa were in on it as well. And the Lone Power better not stand under a coconut tree (thunk!)

And if anyone is familiar with banyan figs, think of what type of ent that would make! Hmm-hoom!!

"Thus is Balance maintained." A Wizard of Earthsea
"Condensing fact from the vapor of nuance." Neal Stephenson, Snow Crash

[PK]

Meteorite: Oooh, nice. And thank you, now I'm cracking up at the idea of a tree dropping a coconut on the Lone Power's head....

*knows enough about banyans to boggle at the image of one walking!*

[Birdhead]

*giggles* Coconuts. Heh.

In interesting fact (and picture): The world's biggest kauri tree is Tane Mahuta, named after the god Tane. It's in New Zealand, up north, and it is HUGE. I've seen it and it- I dunno, it's amazing. Awesome in the more literal sense. I know it's not as big as those trees, what, redwoods I think.. but it's big enough for me. There's a smallish picture here, in scale with people...
T

Tuibird in Aotearoa
Conservationist, Scientist, and proud of both!
Chocolate lover extraordinaire...
Ahahahaha, ahahahahaha, ahahahaha...
My mission: Bringing Maori to the world!
Spelling Freak and Typo Queen

[semiramis]

about half a year since last post... *is not bothering to actually count*
But I felt I had to put in my two cents. As in, Judeo-Christian stuff... (and before anyone asks, no, I'm not Christian, so I'm sorry if I offend anyone with this or anything)

Would anyone agree that maybe the Old Tom is the Shekinah and/or the Metatron (who are sometimes equated, anyway)? There's the entire consort/gift to oneself thing going on here, as well as the "lesser YHWH" for the Metatron...

And, about the Whisperer... I'm hovering between St. Raphael and St. Gabriel for Him/Her/It. What do you think? I mean, Raphael is the saint of science and wisdom, whereas Gabriel is the saint of communications (and, incidentally, communications workers... am thinkindg about telemarketers...). And then I'm leaning towards the angel Raziel, who wrote the Sefer Raziel, a book which is supposed to contain all of the wisdom in the world or somesuch... this could be interpreted as the Book of Night with Moon or the manual.

Also, I know the Lone One has been established as Satan in Judeo-Christian lore, but I've got something interesting to bring up: the Devil, in Islamic lore, is an angel by name of Iblis/Eblis/however-it's-spelled, who refused to bow before mortal man on account of his being able to lie. The intriguing thing about this is that most of the other angels seemed to agree with him that mankind should not have been created; the only one who agreed with Allah on the creation of man was in fact the Angel of Death, Azrael. So it seems to all be reversed here, unless Azrael is post-redemption/pre-fall Lone One...?

I am Lionfish. HEAR ME ROA-- ....um, bubble. Blub, blub. *sweatdrop*

[Tabby]

PK: Are you by any chance Persephone Kore from fanfiction.net, or is this just a *really* wild coincidence?

[PK]

Tabby: Yes, I am.

Semiramis: I am Christian, but haven't made a study of angel-lore. *shrugs* At any rate, the Sefer Raziel does sound as if it could have inspired the Book of Night with Moon -- and it's stated somewhere (I think in, er, The Book of Night with Moon, actually) that the manuals are excerpts or made up of excerpts from that, so it'd be both.

I have recently been informed that in Judaism the concept of a rebellious angel doesn't actually work, and Satan is best described as the Adversary or prosecutor, sent to test people. This actually would explain the reference in the New Testament as well about Michael, in dispute, not "bringing a railing accusation" against him (used as an example of correct behavior). YW references that could be related to this might be Fred's reluctance to say the Lone Power is wrong (despite unequivocally opposing its local behavior... I also suspect that Its role as Mistress of the Tenth Life for cats could imply something similar for stars becoming black holes... er, anyway) and the comment in Abroad about even It having a role to play.

[semiramis]

Yah. I'm pretty sure the devil, hell, etc. are all post-Judaism concepts; the only reference to the "evil" devil in the Torah/Old Testament would be a misinterpretation of an invocation to Solomon (I think it was him, at least; it called him the "fallen star of morning"). The closest thing they have to rebellious angels, I believe are the ones that "cohabited with the daughters of man" in... was it Genesis? And the leader was either Azza or Azazel or Uzza, I forget (or are they interchangeable?). Although, aside from its being breifly mentioned in Genesis (or other such), most of the information is found in the apocryphals (the Book of Enoch in this case, I think... although I may be wrong). But I'm not sure that counts...

I am Lionfish. HEAR ME ROA-- ....um, bubble. Blub, blub. *sweatdrop*