Ebook Readers?

[kk]

Jacq: Did you just mention Interead's Cool-er reader? Be sure to read a lot of reviews about it, because I was originally going to get that one, but I read the reviews and those who bought one said there were some serious issues with it, like the buttons being hard to press, and the menus hard to navigate through. I can't remember all of what the reviews said, but I'd research first before deciding.

When I looked through the weird things people were saying about the Cool-er (like a random sudoku menu?), I started looking at the eSlick instead, and saw that the functions were pretty much exactly the same, except that the eSlick came with a 2gb SD card, and the Cool-er supported more formats. And the eSlick had an AC adapter...

Maybe three weeks until my ebook reader gets here! ^_^ I'm excited. I've come up with an idea to make a case for it...it'll be very interesting!

[kk]

My ebook reader came a few days ago! I'm so happy!

I can't post pictures (yet), because my camera is broken, and going to be fixed soon... but I will tell about its features:

The Foxit eSlick works really well, I think. It doesn't let you bookmark a page while using the device, though it remembers your spot in the book when you go to read something else, or when you turn off the device. It also recognizes bookmarks that are already in PDFs, which I've found very useful. It also comes with a program for your computer that lets you edit and add bookmarks to PDFs, which is good.

The battery life is really good, and the reflow and landscape functions are practically lifesavers; the text is so much easier to read!

I've already read several books on it, and it's easy to navigate and get used to. And, the screen does look good in any light (except for total darkness, that is).

I think Foxit has worked out almost all of the bugs with this one; I can't seem to find any bugs in it at all! And the new shortcut menu they added to the device is brilliant.

Jacq: Have you decided on what ebook reader you want to get, yet? I've decided that they're very fun things indeed!

[meteorite]

I was thinking of getting a Kindle for my grandma, but it still seems a little expensive for what you get. When they bring the price for one with the big screen below $300, I'll revisit it. Another issue is that Kindles get very odd with proprietary formats -- the latest scandal is that Amazon listed bootleg e-copies of 1984 and Animal Farm, which were bought by a number of people. When Amazon discovered their boo-boo, they retroactively removed the copies from people's Kindles (I think the buyers were refunded, although I don't know to what degree). I'm not in favor of having something I bought summarily taken away, even if I get my money back; the police don't get to confiscate a piece of stolen merchandise I bought in good faith, why does Amazon?

[SpacePen]

the police don't get to confiscate a piece of stolen merchandise I bought in good faith, why does Amazon?

Uh, I'm pretty sure that in some cases, they do. The difference here is that the Amazon Kindle owners were refunded - you don't necessarily get your money back if you buy stolen property and it ends up getting returned to the owner.

[Tuttle]

I'm not in favor of having something I bought summarily taken away, even if I get my money back; the police don't get to confiscate a piece of stolen merchandise I bought in good faith, why does Amazon?

While I understand the complaints, and agree there's a problem - the police do in fact confiscate stolen merchandise you bought in good faith. Also, in those cases you don't get your money back immediately, though you do get a promise that you'll get in back later. I've actually had this happen to me and it caused rather huge problems for me and me/my family is still down $1000 because of it. The original owners were nice about in in my case, but the police can take something you're relying on if it was stolen property if the original owners want it back immediately. In my case it was my laptop which I was relying on for school, and the company which owned it said that I was allowed to finish up the term and replace the laptop after, as long as they got it back right after that. Even so, it messed up my classes to be called up an hour before a midterm and told that my laptop had been stolen in the process of getting to me.

So you know, it had been a full refund for the cost of the book that had been given.

The issue for the kindles is an issue, but I personally feel that is an issue with the kindle store, not the kindle devices. The devices are perfectly good ebook readers without touching the kindle store, even if that's not the normal use of them. I would suggest the sony reader over a kindle outside of the united states - as they look to be slightly nicer devices, but don't have the cellular modem. Truly, that is the thing that sets the kindle apart to me, not the kindle store, but the cellular modem it has. The web browser is horribly minimalist, but lets me use it in any way I'd truly want in the locations I'd not have wifi. I can look up directions to a location, or look for a phone number, or read wikipedia about what has came up in conversation. It's a convenience in a way similar to a cell phone's web browsing. I feel the higher price of a kindle is perfectly justified, they're very nice devices without the store, and paying for cell phone internet for a year on most plans would pay off the price of the kindle. This is the justification that I use for prefering it personally. The price being high is dependent on how you use it. Having ebooks, a little bit of music, and a web browser with me is worth $300 to me, because of how I function (even if I would not have paid it because of being a poor college student).

It does often bother me that the kindle is thought to be so tightly tied to amazon's store and proprietary format. It does read other formats, even if the small one doesn't support native pdf. Like I have said, I have not bought a book from amazon - though I do technically have public domain books downloaded through the kindle store (though the one of those I've actually been reading I actually converted from guteberg's copy myself to give myself line breaks). Baen free library and the associated to pay site are my friends . I need to get around to buying one of the sets of 5 books for $10, because one of the books it contains is one I very much want to read.

Of course I do have problems with the drm, and would actively search out drm-free copies of books before I would buy a drmed copy. I think that amazon's store should work with any ebook reader, not simply the kindle, though only wirelessly with the kindle. The drm is easy enough to break that it won't stop anyone from pirating the books anyways (and I've not actually looked into breaking it, I just happen to know the basic idea).

Generally, I'm a fan of any e-ink ebook reader, and think that there should be competition in this market. If I had bought myself something I actually probably would have gotten an olpc instead of a specialized reader, because the reading mode on them are actually impressive, but I've gotten to carrying my kindle in a waterproof case with me everywhere.

I would say, if you know someone with an olpc, do look at them in the reading mode. They're impressive little beasties. I'd suggest checking one out before buying one for the purpose of reading, but I seriously would have done so before I had the kindle.

...I was not meaning this to be too much of a kindle rant, just wanted to reply on the stolen merchandise issue, because it is something I have had to deal with before. Am trying to break my kindle obsession... but that's kinda turning into a baen free library + kindle obsession . Free science fiction and fantasy books for me to read, plus a nice device to read them on...happy Tuttle.

[Lazy Leopard]

How much has the ebook reader market changed in the last five years (or so)? One of these days I'll have to get myself an ebook reader, if only because there are books I want to read that aren't available at all in good old paper versions. I've just not, yet, seen a reader I could deal with...

[Tuttle]

What do you think it'd take for it to be one "you can deal with?" I personally love my kindle, and see major changes in it from the one I got 5 years ago. But, they are different than paper books, some clear advantages, some disadvantages, though for me there are few disadvantages.

The market is focused on a few companies -

Amazon of course is the main one. They're who I support because I think they do the best job, and who pretty much everyone agrees as the best ebook reader (they also have the most books available in their market directly and best support), getting epubs onto a kindle means coverting formats though, which some people don't want to have to deal with, and they are the bigest players.

Barnes and Noble has the nook - they are a lot less into the game than they were a few years ago, but are a lot better than they were 5 years ago.

There are multiple Kobo devices, including the only itself waterproof one on the market.

There are smaller companies of course, but those are the big three.

[Lazy Leopard]

My guess is I'd need something e-paper-ish rather than all technicolour, and light enough to go in a pocket without causing leaden-pocket...

As the books I'd most want to put on it first would be the YW new editions, I guess one or other of the Kobo devices might do. Mostly, the books I'd want to read on it would be the ones that don't make it to paper. Waterproof sounds good.

[Tuttle]

Oh, yeah, if its not eink I don't consider it an ebook reader. There are some other technologies being developed that would also qualify, but none others in market that I know of. Nothing back-lit qualifies.

Those three brands are the ones I'd look at. They all have various pluses and minuses.

I wouldn't care at all about what type of files it takes, ignore that completely in how you evaluate them. DD sells both epub and mobi, so you wouldn't have to do any conversions in either direction, most places do that, and if there's some odd place that only sells one, conversion is trivial. Most books that are only online are places like direct-from-the-author and really careful to have both epub and mobi though.

In general ebook readers are small now. Again, they're all pretty similar in size, details vary, but I'd not worry about it being too heavy and large if you're going for a dedicated device. They are 6" screens, so it'd have to be a pocket that can take that, but I drop mine into my pocket-vest pocket comfortably and without it seeming heavy, because its tiny and light.

They vary in what they have for features. There are ones with front-lit screens (so they have lights built in, to bounce off the front, not operating like a backlight at all), ones without, ones with higher resolution screens than others, ones with cell connections, ones with wifi-only. But, that comes down to choosing how simple you want.

I think as long as it is an eink device you'd do well. I know that the prices are a lot better than they were too. It's not like they're the $360 they were 5 years ago. The kobos vary from $99-$179, kindles from $79-$199 and the nook is $99.

[Lazy Leopard]

Yeah, I've tried reading books off tablets and laptops, and it doesn't really even work for me even for fairly short stuff, never mind something as long as a novel. I went looking in shops today, and found both Kindle and Kobo devices on display. As they were in different shops I couldn't compare them side by side, but I got the impression their screens were almost exactly the same size. My eyes are getting old, and I could really use a screen a bit bigger than the 6" standard, but I guess they use what's available.

Edit: Oh, and I tracked down Calibre, which seems to deal with things like converting formats, at least for DRM-free stuff. I then remembered that I'd once had some eBooks on an old PalmPilot I never quite managed to make really useful, and after a bit of burrowing I found a backup of its contents in a zip file I'd sent home from work a decade or more ago. I'll see whether they'll convert readably from .PDB to something less ancient if I actually get an eBook reader.

[Lazy Leopard]

I wouldn't care at all about what type of files it takes, ignore that completely in how you evaluate them. DD sells both epub and mobi, so you wouldn't have to do any conversions in either direction

I notice the 9-volume YW(ME) set is available in a bunch of formats tailored for various devices. Not knowing what device I'll end up with, I'd go for a generic .epub if there was one, but at the moent there isn't.

I suppose I could just wait for (and hope there is) the next sale, by which time I'll (hopefully) know what I've got...

[The White Falcon]

What's your main complaint with tablets?

Personally, I dislike e-ink readers with touchscreen only interaction. I prefer ones with physical page-turn buttons. The market is pretty slim these days however.

Kobo's aren't bad, but their US support is kinda slim as far as buying hardware, and my initial impression of the Aura HD was that it felt cheap. That being said, my eReaders have always been metal-cased so anything plastic will probably feel cheap to me. YMMV.

The problem with Amazon is you're locked to a Kindle, the books aren't in an open format like ePub. Yes, there are tools to strip the DRM but conversion can be messy (I converted a lot of .rdr to .txt, that was a trip).

I don't have a lot of experience with the Nook, but it is true they're definitely de-emphasizing it at B&N.

One consideration is that while they've definitely killed the Reader Store, and they aren't selling them anymore, Sony did sell off their parts of the business to Kobo, which means the later Reader models will work with Kobo books and the Kobo Store. I know the PRS-Tx series works even on the device. I haven't tested to see if the earlier ones still read the books, but I will take a look at it today. That being said the Reader software was always clunky so I just use Calibre. EDIT: Looks like you can get the books on the older devices still. The PRS-500 is a bit old and if it wasn't upgraded to support ePub it can't do anything, so I would pass on that regardless.

But, the reason I bring this up is that they can be had for good prices; I bought a new in box PRS-505 for $45 around January 2014.

And don't forget Project Gutenberg, where you can download older titles to your hearts content.

[Lazy Leopard]

For reading, tablets have two problems. First there's battery life, and second there's the whole eye-strain thing of reading from luminous screens the whole time. My phone's a Nexus 5, which isn't that bad as those things go. It's fine for photos, and I can more-or-less use it for some basic social media stuff, but not for reading anything much longer than (say) a thousand words at a go. It'd be completely hopeless for reading a novel on. While eInk isn't wonderful, I think it'll be better from that point of view, but it's still rather a "least-worst" option for things that aren't available on my medium of choice, good old paper.

I've had a look at the basic Kindle and Kobo readers, and the six-inch screen is really just a bit small. The (allegedly waterproof) Kobo Aura H2O has a slightly bigger screen, and the comparative reviews aren't too bad, so I'll probably go for one of them, but more for the screen size than because they're supposed to be waterproof.

Thanks for all the pointers. I'll report back if I have anything on the subject worth relating...

[The White Falcon]

See, I read with my iPad Air a fair amount. Generally my Sony unit is for YW, Gutenberg titles, and some older books I've had for a while. I pick up titles on iBooks if I don't think I'll worry too much about having it in the future (it's unlikely Apple will go under anytime soon, but hey...pays to be safe). If I think I'll want it for posterity or if I had earlier titles in the series in print, I'll buy the physical copy.

That being said even with an iPhone 6 I don't enjoy reading on my phone, the text is a bit cramped (I kinda want an iPad mini for that reason alone but haven't been able to justify it beyond that).

With a good LED backlit IPS panel and a high enough pixel density eye-strain really isn't an issue.

[Lazy Leopard]

Eye-strain can be a rather personal thing. I'm quite short-sighted, and if I'm going to be reading for any length of time I tend to take my glasses off and hold the book quite close. This doesn't work well with screens with resolutions any much less than 200dpi. Others with better eyes would hold the screen at a more sensible distance.

Battery life is another matter altogether. I'd need to get an hour or two of reading a day out of a device I won't be able to recharge for a week or two. Tablets would't help here, as there's always the temptation to use the tablet for some of the other things tablets are good for. I've found it's hard to go somewhere taking a tablet if it isn't going to be possible to charge it at least once a day.

Of course, real paper is the best option unless weight's an issue.