If Nita Had Died (Spoilers for later books)

[smile]

If Nita was eaten by Ed, I don't know what Kit would have done. I think he would've gone back and then do something drastic (he was saying both he and Nita had to get out alive). We know Nita would go to timeheart, and Ed would be still alive... If it had been Nita not Ed, then the sharks would not have come and the song might not've worked, because she might not have even finished... Any ideas?

[wolf_wizard]

I think that the song would have still worked, just not to the extreme (possitive) effect that it did. They unwittingly did the song EXTREMELY effectively; possibly more effectively that would have been possible if it was Nita who had died; but it could still have worked. and Ed could have still called sharks without dieing.

[spyells]

I think that Wolf Wizard is right. I think that the song would have still worked. In fact as we all know the song had been done for centuries and had always worked. I don't see a reason for why it wouldn't had worked then. But I do have to admit the song certainly worked better than what all of them had anticipated.

[Tuttle]

I think the more interesting thing to think about in terms of Nita's death would be Kit's reaction. I think the sacrifice she would have made and the fact it had been done for centuries before is more than enough to say it would have worked if Ed didn't make the move he did.

So, if it had gone as planned and as it had been done for centuries past is one way of thinking about this, however, the one I think is more interesting is Kit.

Kit would have lost his partner if she had gone through with it. Would he do something drastic? If so how drastic? I don't think he'd have gone so far as suicide but I wouldn't be surprised if it crossed his mind - though its not something a wizard should do. I think he'd go insane on his wizardry - that he'd have a while that he'd not want to do anything because it was too painful, both in terms of actions and in terms of wizardry. And then go, she didn't die for this, and go strongly in the other direction. At that point I think he'd not mind if he died, but would want to in the line of work- partially to be reunited, partially to do whatever he can do keep fighting.

Comparing to Nita's reaction after her mom's death, I think it'd be stronger. She was someone who he was closer to than I think most boyfriend/girlfriend pairs are (is part of why I am the way I am in terms of shippiness, thinking it'd work them together, it'd work with them apart, they're something beyond that which makes romance nice, but goes noticeably beyond it).

I'm not sure really how he'd react, but that's about how I think I'd eventually react if it happened to me -and I really think that he'd work in her name for the rest of his life. Maybe find another partner he can work with to make up for the fact he's been broken from that point, maybe not. I think it'd be possible for him to do that as long as he kept working in her name to some degree.

[wolf_wizard]

I don't think he'd be able to find another partener, as he would have been to close to Nita. He wouldn't have wanted to be working with someone else partly because he would have wanted to shield himself from more pain, because he would want to keep others from experienceing that pain, because he wouldn't want to ummm I don't know how to explain it... kind of split apart from their relationship, and have a partenership with someone else, so he'd always feel guilty about it... I think he would fight really hard against the LP, and at the same time not really caring about dieing. I like what you said as well Tuttle, but I also think that he wouldn't really be caring so much about dieing. I just don't think that he would be able to have another partener. I wouldn't if i were in that situation. But everything else i agree with.

Dai all

[Wizfan_6]

I agree that he wouldn't care about dying, and that he probably wouldn't get an new partner. However, I think he'd either become the strongest fighter against the LP at the cost of not really seeing anything else in the world, or he'd give up wizardry all together.
At this point in the series, he doesn't really seem to have any other people that would hold him up like Nita does when Nita's mom dies later in the series. His sadness could blind him enough that he'll fight against the LP alone (which might kill him physically), or it could kill his will to continue the fight and he'd lose his wizardry.
Either way, Kit wouldn't have much of a life left compared to before Nita's death.

Also, what would have happened to Dairine?

[wolf_wizard]

Well, I think that he would keep fighting blindly, and give up everything else. I doubt he would give up his wizardry. He would want to remember Nita and wouldn't want to give it up to stop his own pain. He would want to die to stop it and, at the same time helping people like he knew Nita would want him to.

[Emi]

I agree with what Tuttle said, that Kit would be so upset and sad.. He wouldn't be able to concentrate on anything and then he'll come to an epiphany that Nita wouldn't want him to be like this and he'll go back to normal, well not normal normal, but he'll be fighting hard against LP for "revenge"? I don't know, it's not really revenge because she did sacrifice herself... But maybe as a stronger incentive (sp?) to fight. Am I making sense??

[wolf_wizard]

yes, I think that he will have huge incentive to fight the LP, because he would think that Nita would want him to do it. He might also blame himself for her death, because he didn't stop her or some other reason... So he'll want to keep fighting, even if Nita is dead, so that he could he can continue what she was doing. I don't know if he would be to reckless, and die fighting, but it seems likely.

[mysss]

A similar sacrifice of his own seems in order to me.... He might come through, but would be reeeally lonely. Maybe he'd have some regrets about his relationship with her *winks at tuttle*.

[Tuttle]

I don't think him getting a new partner is something to expect, but I see it as completely viable. In regards to having cared about her too much and still doing so, think about situations we know about. People get remarried after they are widowed. People date others after having issues break them up with their first love.

The difference is that their relationship is an extremely strong platonic love that is rare to happen. However it does still happen in this world at times. I don't know how many people even have the capability to be quite that close -it sometimes feels like very few, but there's this group I've found can manage a closeness comparatively. I am saying this out of personal experience as I am one who does get friends that close and I know I could personally not date anyone who I didn't have a relationship with that you could see getting that strong (for me at least, it didn't take long after meeting them even to know that the friendship would be stronger than the average friendship, you can almost identify others like this within you friends because you feel it so early on (at least to both me and boyfriend)).

And I know that there are people who have had situations where they lost someone (though I don't know of any situations where it was death..., but still) when they were that close and found someone else later. This is part of why I think it'd be so very possible for Kit to find someone else without forgetting about Nita. Just because he's really close to Nita does not mean there's nobody else out there who he could be as close to even if he is influenced still by Nita's life and death.

And he's strong, he'd be able to pull through at least some. He'd probably lose his will to do anything beyond wizardry for at least a few years, but he'd at least have that.

I don't think he'd feel guilty if he didn't forget about her. He'd still have her memory, it'd still mean as much as it did before, he'll still love her even (because yes, Nita and Kit love each other, though that doesn't mean they'll ever be romantically entwined with each other), but he'd have someone else too that he's close to and works magic with.

The point that Nita had others to hold her up when her mother dies is a good one, but I don't think discredits any major things he'd do. It'd be harder on him, but I don't think that'd make him give up his life or his wizardry.


What'd happen to Dairine is also interesting. I think she'd take it really hard and would have a similar reaction in the locking up against wizardry then taking it more, or that she'd try to hide, have the mobiles for friends and be close to them and use them to get through. She'd not sleep much, would probably drop hugely in school, etc. We saw her reaction to her mom's death, I imagine it similar.

Her parents would take it really hard,parents shouldn't outlive their children.

I can't imagine what it'd be for Dair and her dad when her mother also dies. That'd be really hard.

[christmas]

But would Dairine even become a wizard if Nita had died? I mean, to Dairine's eleven or twelve year old mind, wizardry is what killed her sister. Would Dairine want anything to do with wizardry after that? And even if she did, who's to say she would be as reckless as she was in HW? She would probably see wizardry as something dangerous, not just as fun and games and the chance to do something important. So she mighyt not even have found the mobiles. If Nita had died, everything would have happened a lot differently, because not only would her death have a significant impact on the lives of those around her, but her choices and decisions and ideas in the rest of the books wouldn't be there anymore. So who's to say that the other events would have even happened? and who's to say that Kit would have even kept his wizardry? After all, he only has memories of Nita through wizardry. If he gave it up, he would forget her too, and the pain would be gone. And when you're in that much pain, you don't always think rationally.

[Emi]

That's a good point Christmas. I don't think Dair would even think about reading the oath if Nita died. I mean, she would be so afraid of wizardy, because that's exactly what killed her sister. Sure, her curiosity would still be there, but she'd be more hesitant to even go there. Everything would happen, but just with Nita not there. Dairine won't know why her mom died, except that it was cancer, not the LP. To her it would be as wizardy is the thing that killed her family... and I don't think I'd go in to something that did that to me...

Just a thought.

[wolf_wizard]

yes, and besides that she might take the oath... remember that point where she looks up Nita in the manual? I think that once she found out how Nita had died, she wouldn't be willing to be a wizard anymore, and magic does not live in the unwilling heart. And once she became a wizard, I think that she would find out just how her mom and sister died. and she might ask Kit if he was still around... i'm not sure....

[christmas]

but with her mom, it would have been completely different too. since nita wouldn't have been there to do an intervention, her mom would have just died of cancer, and not because of everything that happened in WD. you guys have to think outside of everything you know about the books. if you think of it in terms of completely removing nita (and possibly dairine) from the equation, you end up with an alternate reality where the ireland intervention never happened, kit gets stuck inside of darryl's autism world (if he even decides to help) and even if he didn't, he wouldn't know ronan, so the hesper never would have been able to emerge in W@W, and he never would have gone to alaalu in WH because it was an action of dairine's (who probably doesn't become a wizard) that got him into that in the first place, and also because of that, the "house guests" would have never been a part of the equation either

another way to swing it is dairine thinks that by becoming a wizard she can bring nita back to life, so she becomes a wizard, and she and kit become partners. the bond is never as close as it was between him and nita (it could never be, because their ordeal was a huge bonding thing, and kit and dairine could never have an experience quite like that) but they would still be pretty close. you have to think of things in terms of what nita herself caused, and what the effects of them were on all of the other characters. and then you have to think of what kind of effect nita's death would have on the other characters, and how that would affect their actions. and when you think about it, if nita had died, and the rest of the things that happened still ahppened, just without her influence, the entire universe would be on its way to destruction.

and then when you think about that, and you realize how big of an effect nita's had on the fate of the universe, you wonder how the powers could have let her die in the first place....