Does anyone here belive in magic?

[Onua Wingstar]

Originally posted by bluesalamanders:
Onua-

How do you define "magic"?

Blue

I think magic is anything that lies outside the realm of "normality;" magic is making things happen by tapping into the "fabric of reality" so to speak. For instance, if one day someone invented a device that could, say, change the color of your living room by remotely manipulating the molecules in the wall, then that would be pretty magical, even if the people using the system took it for granted.

Magic is also (more accurately, I think) what you get when you pray. Magic is people from one test-group healing faster than people in another test group because the people in the first group have people praying for them. It's the influence of the divine (the unseen/the unknowable) on our world and ourselves (the seen/knowable).

That's the best I can exlain it. ^_^

[Peter Murray]

I can touch a box on the wall, and a bright light fills the room, much brighter than candlelight, and the light will last all night, if I want it to, without my needing to change any candles. 200 years ago, that would have seemed magical.

I can see people performing stories on the box near the window, although it's too small for anyone to be inside. Again, 200 years ago, that would have seemed magical.

If you had a device that could change the colour as you say, it might seem like magic, but it wouldn't be magic, it would be technological.

[worlebird]

Originally posted by Onua Wingstar:
For instance, if one day someone invented a device...

As people have already pointed out, technology may LOOK like magic to those who do not understand it, but that doesn't make it magic, at least not in the sense that most people use the word.

Originally posted by Onua Wingstar:
Magic is also (more accurately, I think) what you get when you pray. Magic is people from one test-group healing faster than people in another test group because the people in the first group have people praying for them. It's the influence of the divine (the unseen/the unknowable) on our world and ourselves (the seen/knowable).

That is an interesting example. Especially considering that it doesn't hold up in real life.
Check out this article from the Seattle Times, reprinted from the Chicago Tribune (the same article can be found in many papers around the world):
Study on Prayer

A quick summary of the article: researchers did the exact study you propose. They got a bunch (1802, to be precise) patients who were about to undergo heart surgery. The patients were divided into three groups: group one would be prayed for and were told such; group two would be prayed for and were not told; and group three would not be prayed for and were not told (they were the "control group").

The results were surprising. Those who were prayed for but were not told fared equally well with those who were not prayed for and not told. Those who were prayed for and were told actually fared WORSE. They had more complications and took longer to recover on average.

Huh.

[Onua Wingstar]

I take it you don't go in for the faith thing, then? ^_^

I guess it can be hard for some people, if they've never experienced it themselves. But what can you do?

And as for the point about technology, again I ask, are certain super-advanced technologies really all that different from magic? Maybe they are, but maybe they aren't. The question was about how we define magic, wasn't it? Can you give another definition?

[Artisin]

OF COURSE! I definatly believe in magic! I wish I was a wizard so badly! More than anything I want to take the Oath and become a wizard!

[Slash]

Artisin, well alot of people think that once you come to read the DD book you are a Wizard in your own sooper way! ^_^ And if you wan't to make you feel more like a wizard you can always go on chat and ... you knoe ummm how do I say this?
ummm for a example...

<span class="ev_code_BLUE">Mousey: *throws magic rock at YRs head*</span>
<span class="ev_code_BLACK">Youngreader: Why did you do that?</span> <span class="ev_code_GREEN">
Mousey went to the moon </span>
<span class="ev_code_BROWN">Peter Murray: Don't fight on chat *wags finger at YR*</span>
<span class="ev_code_PURPLE">Slash: *Follows mousey too da moon*</span>

And there are more stuff you can do, well you can battle but PM and Kli complane aboute you guys doing that so I would not if i were you ... but you can go too the moon like mousey did (and me).

[Peter Murray]

Originally posted by Onua Wingstar:
And as for the point about technology, again I ask, are certain super-advanced technologies really all that different from magic? Maybe they are, but maybe they aren't.

"Any sufficiently-advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" -- science fiction writer Arthur C. Clarke.

He was one of the team who developed radar in World War Two. Imagine that, being able to detect enemy aeroplanes coming from all that way away. It's like magic!

But that doesn't mean it is magic.

[Artisin]

Originally posted by Slash:
Artisin, well alot of people think that once you come to read the DD book you are a Wizard in your own sooper way! ^_^ And if you wan't to make you feel more like a wizard you can always go on chat and ... you knoe ummm how do I say this?
ummm for a example...

<span class="ev_code_BLUE">Mousey: *throws magic rock at YRs head*</span>
<span class="ev_code_BLACK">Youngreader: Why did you do that?</span> <span class="ev_code_GREEN">
Mousey went to the moon </span>
<span class="ev_code_BROWN">Peter Murray: Don't fight on chat *wags finger at YR*</span>
<span class="ev_code_PURPLE">Slash: *Follows mousey too da moon*</span>

And there are more stuff you can do, well you can battle but PM and Kli complane aboute you guys doing that so I would not if i were you ... but you can go too the moon like mousey did (and me).

Thanks! lol.

[Dragon Writer]

Wow...I'm being used in examples...Cool! :P

[kagome88888]

personally I dont believe in magic, I dont believe in the unexplainable. to me anything that we cannot explain as of yet is simply unexplained because we haven't reached that leval of understanding yet. I do believe that some people have an advanced understanding of things that can make things occur by what seems like magic. now that I have stated that I should say that I am not someone who can stare something in the face and deny it's exisatnce, if I was telaported to the moon or something of that nature I would consider magic to be real. I have a scientific nature, and contrary to popular belief that does not make me close minded it only means I analyze a situation before I determine it's nature. therefore if I did consider magic to be real I would take it as an little known science, but until then I see no proof of magic, miracles, angels, ghosts, witches, wizards, vampires, warewolves, or any of the other sience fiction we see. in fact according to study's the things we precieve as supernatural comes from previous assuptions built on the things we have read or seen. for instance the idea of vampires originally came from a queen who would bathe in the blood of her servants, that didnt make her suppernatural just an evil human being.

[kagome88888]

Originally posted by bluesalamanders:
I don't believe in gods, religion, or magic. I do believe in science, but that's not the same kind of belief. I also believe in aliens (as in, the existance of non-earth-life in other galaxies, not alien abductions and that stuff), but again, not the same kind of belief.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Fox said:

by human nature we have to have something to believe in.

I disagree. What we have to have is a way to understand and so be able to deal with our surroundings. Gods, magic, and so on, are ways of explaining things that we don't yet understand. But science - and thus our understanding of the world and universe around us - is expanding constantly and explaining those things that were previously unknowable.

Fox said:
Is it a coincidence that so many strange things happen to people?

Well...yes.

Gigo said:
There MIGHT be magic, and it would be cool if it did exist

I find the idea far more terrifying than cool. Life isn't like books and movies. The good guys don't always win. I don't even want to imagine the truly horrific things that the bad guys could do if any sort of magic were real. They do enough terrible things without it.

~Pont </div>[quote]

I completely agree, for instance the greeks explained the rising of the sun as being drawn by a charriot, they had to explain it somehow and thus for every nartural occurance a god or creature was created along with a story. Therefore if I said managed to convince a large group of people that the moon is made of cheese and that we were made by gnomes, then it could be considered a religion so long as we worshiped gnomes and cheese. see my point?

[kagome88888]

Originally posted by balthasar:
Magics got to exist, where do you think these ancient stories came from. Like people are brilliant, but not that brilliant. The notion of the existence of magic must have come from the witness of someone doing maigc.

The ancient stories came from people who believed they had experienced magic of some sort such as dreams that they could fly, or from seeing unusual people such as people who don't have nerve endings and can stick all sorts of things in themselves without feeling it, or simese twins or even every day occurances, coincedences (sp?) if you will. from there imagination kicks in. for instance if you were ever afraid of monsters it's most likely that you saw something that seemed scary at night, also the body can cause strange reactions, many religious rituals caused people to go without food, water or sleep for several days causing illusions, the body may cause you to see an object as moving if only for a moment of its own accord out of fatiuge, sorry to post so much at the same time but I'm reading all the posts and responding to them as i see them.

[Onua Wingstar]

Originally posted by Peter Murray:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Onua Wingstar:
And as for the point about technology, again I ask, are certain super-advanced technologies really all that different from magic? Maybe they are, but maybe they aren't.

"Any sufficiently-advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic" -- science fiction writer Arthur C. Clarke.

He was one of the team who developed radar in World War Two. Imagine that, being able to detect enemy aeroplanes coming from all that way away. It's like magic!

But that doesn't mean it is magic. </div>[quote]


I knew someone said it.

But anyway, that still doesn't answer my question. How do you define magic?

[Dragon Writer]

Originally posted by kagome88888:
personally I dont believe in magic, I dont believe in the unexplainable.

It's not unexplainable. It just depends on how you look at it. For example, in the stories i'm writing, it's filled with magic, and it all fills out, and is very logical at the same time. :P

[MagikMelody]

I believe in magic and i think i always will.

Magic has been recorded as being used from countries in Europe, Asia, and the Americas before the Europeans ever set foot there. These people never communicated, yet they believed in the same types of magic and believed that certain people were born with the skill. Without the few minor variations, their beliefs would be exactly the same.

That is a thought that always keeps me convinced. How would people in America somehow believe in the exact same thing as someone in Europe if they had never met and influenced each other.

I also believe in magic because i just have that gut feeling that it exists, as many of u im sure also do.

also, if magic didnt exist, wouldnt the belief have died out long ago? Sure, some books might still be fantasy, but their wouldnt be people believing they were magic or could perform magic if it didnt exist. SOMEONE at some point must have succeeded. its like a competitive team. if your on a team that keeps losing, you lose faith in ur team, stop trying, and never win again (or win very raerly) if you are on a team that wins, you believe in urself and believe that u can win, because ur past winnings have showed that you can. i believe magic is much the same. if no one ever succeeded, we would lose faith and it would rise very rarelt in the human world. yet, many people still believe, therefore, someone must have succeeded at least once in the human history.

ok. im done now