Universe DNA

[Caitlin]

So, if you think about it, the Kernels are really like a Universe's DNA (and not just because I'm a Biochem nut XD); it controls all of everything that happens in the universe. Every litte minutae is controlled by the Kernel, just like the DNA of a cell.

But is the Kernel suceptible to the same things DNA is? DNA can mutate. It can mess up when replicating. Does the Kernel ever mutate? Could it spontaneously shift, and change the whole Universe? Wizards are good (especially the cats), but could shuch a change be fixed, if it came from the Universe itself? Invasions from the outside can be fixed (See: LP and Alaalu), like a virus. Changes made by another wizard can be reversed as well. If the Universe changes itself, do Wizards have the capactiy to put the world back to where it is supposed to be?

[Birdhead]

but could shuch a change be fixed, if it came from the Universe itself?

It's a fun analogy. But I think the question is more, should a change be fixed? if it comes from the Universe? I mean, I think Dairine's actions in HW would have had a pretty fundamental effect on the kernel, without her actually getting down and dirty with the thing itself. I mean, some DNA changes might represent a kind of evolution of the universe. In fact, the universe has changed - Dairine puts a timeslide way back to the beginning of the universe, a universe which is fundamentally different from the current one. And that universe probably wouldn't have supported human life real well. So that's a DNA change that, personally, I think is O.K.

I sort of wonder if that's related to all the messing around in W@W.

[Dragon Writer]

the problem with the universe changing, is this: people are messing around with the dna of the universe so much in these books, how do you know what comes naturally, and what's the effect of someone messing around? who knows what it does to the universe every time nita plays with the kernals? It might have farther reaching consequences then she suspected, you know!

[Caitlin]

Not every change is good, though. What if the change is a blip that annhiliates all life in the Universe? That would be they very worst of occurrances, but under the 'should we?' question, it makes a major ethical dilemma for wizards. If it was what the Universe wanted, then they just have to accept the catastrophic loss of life and move on. If it is just a mutation, then it can be fixed and all that life can be saved.

*runs back to re-check W@W for Kernel-messing*

[Tuttle]

So looking here there are two questions

1. Could wizards change the "DNA" of the universe?

2. If they could, should they?

On the first question, continuing the comparision, there is the fact that humans and scientists can play with the DNA of every living thing including humans. Wizards rather than working with a scientific DNA work with a more spiritual one, and this could go either way. There is this issue of the amount of power which would be necessary, but that could be overcome with focusing and feeding power to those working. It could be done like Nita's charm bracelet to some degree.
But could they alter something so large? The challenge would be to find the kernal of something as large as the universe, but if they could do such a thing I see no reason why they couldn't mess with it, because the universe is a growing and evolving thing like the rest of life.
This does mean that someone else would also have the ability to mess with the kernal if they could find it and get it as well, which does give a problem for the wizards. What if the lone power was to get the kernal somehow? Would he be able to speed up entropy then? Probably not, because entropy is probably one of those things which is constant in the universe. Wizards can't remove it just eliminate it, and those they're fighting can't fundamentally change it either, just work on maximizing it. That does make sense to me at least.

So if they could, then would it be right too? There is the question of 'Is this what the universe wants it to be like?' but at the same time there's the question of 'Did someone else cause this?' and 'Even if it mutated this direction, does that mean its wrong to fix?' There are two fundamental arguments for this with people on varying levels. Either one which in our scientific world saying we should not mess with the DNA of animals and humans because it is not natural, and those which say, we are part of nature too, and what we do is natural because of that. We have this ability, we have either had it granted to us, or earned it through evolution. I personally am closer to the second, saying that we can do this, we are part of nature if we look at it in that direction, and thus what we do is in fact natural. But this doesn't at all mean its good or that we should do something just because we ethically can. This is one step, and we'd need to look at every step. In terms of messing with the universes kernal, there is a huge risk involved with doing such a thing, and only if it was worth that risk would it be a good idea to in my mind. If there is a major mutation wiping out all life, yes you should. If one star is going to super nova, then it's better to fix it on a smaller level. We'd not be able to look at it as a fix all if this was the case, because there would be a negative side effect to everything that is done, and with something as large as tampering with the universe's kernal, this is a large side effect.

To summarize: in my view, yes it'd be possible, and in extreme circumstances it'd be the right thing to do.

[Dragon Writer]

isn't that what wizards DO though? change the way natures moving? I mean, as much as i hate to admit it, but isn't entropy natural? it might not have been MEANT to exist, but it WAS put into the universe, and it IS a natural thing now...it's what wizards DO< changing the course of things...particularly when it means helping people...*shrugs* that's just what i think though. (this does NOT mean go around arbitrarily changing the shape, form, or whatever else you can think of, of the universe however!)

[Birdhead]

What if the lone power was to get the kernal somehow? Would he be able to speed up entropy then? Probably not, because entropy is probably one of those things which is constant in the universe.

So there must be some kind of barrier on finding and using the kernel, because otherwise IMO the LP would have done just that. I mean, we saw in the Other New York that entropy rates can be changed. We saw the LP complaining vociferously to Michael about how much energy he was allowed and how fast it got used up in his little universe. In retrospect I bet he set up his universe the way he did by using the kernel. of that little universe - as distinct from The Universe.

So I'm gradually leaning towards the notion that, short of every wizard in the Universe working in tandem, it wouldn't be possible to really affect the kernel - if the LP can't do it, and I think he would if he could (certainly pre-HW), then it's improbable that mortal wizards could - or even his fellow Powers. Presumably the One could. Or perhaps in some ways the One is the kernel... but that's a diversion.

IMO, either the kernel is so well-hidden and protected that the LP can't find it and use it, or the Universe's kernel is so complex and big that the LP is literally unable to use it. Like all wizardry, if you want to manipulate the kernel you really have to understand it - and the Universe's kernel would take a hell of a lot of understanding. If the LP can't understand it his sibling Powers probably can't - either they can't or they wouldn't, being too principled, but I find it hard to imagine... say, Peach, sitting around choosing to be inactive in that way. And if the Powers can't, what chance has mortality got? Not a whole heck of a lot.

Although, like I said. If every wizard in the universe worked together...

[Magic Butter]

I think the power and control necessary would need several Powers and the reason would need to be undeniable...

My thoughts: The Kernel defines the behavior of everything inside its Universe (literally, considering Nita could even make the LP unable to even speak in one of the books by tampering with it), then what about the Book of Light and Moon? It defines everything as it should be, so maybe the Universe (or Multiverse?) isn't controlled by a normal Kernel but by the Book, which was even hinted was a form of the One himself. This would also explain why the LP can't mess with it.

As to if they should change the Universe, they do, every time they work magic they bend reality, but the Universe as a whole is a delicate work of art, you change one thing here, and the consequences could be catastrophic...and I think I started rambling, sorry. As always, ignore me if it doesn't make any sense.

[Dragon Writer]

i'm not sure it would take several powers...maybe for the fine work, it would take an unhuman level of attention to detail, but for the big general things...and for the little details, detailing iwth one world, or part of one world, it's just easier to GO to that world...and as for what you said about the book, i'm not sure it controls the universe, so much as it DEFINES It. it works on a different principle! Kernals allow you to change things...the book just reaffirms them. that's why the LP needed a whole new book, rather then simply messing around with what's inside the orriginal. And i think the lp couldn't mess with the book, because as long as the universe is still tuned to it, and still being affirmed by it, messing aound with it could eliminate the LP along with everything else if he tried...(magical books that give definition to all of existance are NOT things you want to mess around with! i don't care WHO you are, that ALWAYS applies.)

[spyells]

I agree with Young Reader that the book defines the universe. I bet the kernel can mutate just like DNA. If it changes I'm not so sure that a wizard or any of the powers should change it back. It seems as if it is a natural accruance if it is being related to DNA. To be honest though I'm not so sure that a wizard would have the capacity to put the universe back. Believe it or not I think that if the universe wanted to change no wizard could argue with it. I need to think about this one.

[Dragon Writer]

the thing about the univere's kernal changing is, it most likely only happpens as a result of the SMALLER kernals changing, as the result of wizards messing around with them...which could lead to unforseen consequences when it comes to the universe itself. Things are structured the way they are for a reason, and they CHANGE for a reason as well...messing around with the kernals might just mess that up.

[Caitlin]

I disagree. It might be because of all the biology I've taken, but I tend to think of the universe like it's a really, really big unicellular organism. I figure The Kernel is like nuclear DNA, and all the rest of the kernels are the mitochondrial DNA of the universe. If anything happens to them, oh well, that's bad, but it won't interfere with the core structure and coding of the universe. Mistakes in those kernels will affect how the universe is running, and the effects will spread- much like a cell. If the mitochondria stops working, the cell has to get creative about finding a source of energy, which interrupts the entire function of the cell. Now, depending on the size and scope of the mistake in the mitochondrial DNA, the breakdown could be small, and contained within the mitochondria, which would not affect the rest of the cell too much, or it could be huge, and debilitate the mitochondria, which would have a catastrophic effect on the cell (kinda like the Pulullus did on the Universe).

I do figure, however, that the One has the basic structure of the Universe locked up, supercoiled so tight nothing can bind to it and cause problems. DNA is absolutely necessary for life. It codes for everything that goes on in the complex little universe which is your body, and has as many protections on it as is chemically possible. It follows the the Universe's Kernel would be in the same position. Just like DNA, if anything were to happen to it- no life.

[Dragon Writer]

in my oppinion, the universe is really made up of everything inside it....the planets, the stars, the moons...all of this TOGETHER makes up the one thing that is the universe. therefore, if all of these thigns change, that changes the universe...if the things that make you up change, does that not change you in turn? if your legs are suddenly turned to tenticles, would that not in some way change your nature? individual changes are too small parts of the universe to really change it as a whole....it may have a ripple effect, and force things to realign themselves in order to work correctly, it their too big, but it doesn't destroy everything. but if you change too many things, too many worlds, too many galaxies....it starts to have an effect on the universe as a whole. at least in my oppinion. if everything that makes it up is suddenly different, then the universe itself will be changing...